Did Jesus & Mary Magdalene have children?

[peacefulwarrior]

:)It's been a question and some findings show possibility. Is it so? Does it matter?

Peace

[mopnglo]

I personally find it a very interesting. After reading The Divinci Code, I did some research, mostly because of the controversy behind the book. The findings that it is a possibility there are direct descendants of Jesus is pretty strong.

Is it a fact? I don't know, but I tend to believe that it is.

Does it matter? Not to me. Why? Well, one might argue that if Jesus married, then he would be human and not the son of God. This is irrelevant. We are all sons and daughters of God. Jesus was the chosen one and gave the ultimate sacrifice for all of our salvation. Why would it matter that he was married along the way? To my way of thinking it wouldn't.

[joe]

It sounds like they may have, to me. It doesn't change anything in a bad way. One would expect a man to marry and have children back then.

[gitpikker58]

Biblically the Bride of Christ is the Church, meaning all people for whom Jesus gave His life for. To single out one person to marry would defeat the existence of Christ. Think of it this way, marriage is a selfish act, one where someone wants another to be with, for satisfaction, gratification, etc, and Jesus wasn't selfish in any way, He was selfless. How could He marry anyone? He's God, and since He IS God that means He created all living beings.
Look at it from Mary M's side, "Oh yeah, YOU'RE perfect, You never do ANYTHING wrong!!! etc"
I really don't believe that the Bible would contradict the facts that it states about Christ's bride. The Duh Vinci code is just that, someone fabricating stories or adding fabrication to what is there, next the gay community will state that Jesus was homosexual since He chose ALL men to be with Him!
Here's another take on it, we are all God's children, sons and daughters, and to choose one over any other, that won't happen, or should I say 'shouldn't' happen.
Anyway, go into the Bible, pray about it, don't take my word or the word of any man on this, pray about it, God is the expert witness.

[mopnglo]

I'm not in anyway saying the Divinci Code is anything other than fiction, however it did open some doors into thinking outside the box, so to speak. Jesus didn't chose only men, nor did only men write the books. Only the men's chapters were put in the bible, but it has been proven that there are chapters written by women that didn't make the final cut, so to speak.

[peacefulwarrior]

:)Mopnglo,
;)Your comments are so "on" as far as things I've studied and looked into. I am always reassured that others out there have had the same thoughts and have taken time to look into it.
Have you looked into the formation of the bible and why the female books were excluded and why women were not given authoritative roles in the churches?

Peace

[mopnglo]

I have only done a bit of research on the subject. I do know there are several "theories" out there. I do tend to believe one in particular over the others I have heard about, just because it would make more sense, or be more logical. I won't go into exactly which "theory" I believe, because to do so would have to point out a certain religion.

I honestly believe everyone has a right to believe as they see fit without judgment, but because my beliefs are different than norm, I've learn to keep my mouth shut, so as not to ruffle feathers or be chastise as I have in the past. That is why I have never ventured into the religious section before now. However, this particular topic piqued my interest and I gave in.

[peacefulwarrior]

;)While I respect discretionary conversation on ideas of faith, God, Jesus, and religion in general, one thing stands out and that is sharing of ideas and thoughts without being chastised or in some radical ways killed for simply thinking different than others is something I believe we should maintain as our basic freedom. Take that away and we lose!!!

:)The rub of your thinking is that you use logic and common sense and that in itself is in conflict with most religious agendas. Free critical thinking has always been purged by religious leaders through the ages. Keep thinking!!

;DForums like this and countries like ours allow this critical thinking and expression. Thank God for our constitution, amendments, and bill of rights and the veterans who have sacrificed to maintain our freedoms.

Peace

[gitpikker58]

mopnglo said:

I'm not in anyway saying the Divinci Code is anything other than fiction, however it did open some doors into thinking outside the box, so to speak. Jesus didn't chose only men, nor did only men write the books. Only the men's chapters were put in the bible, but it has been proven that there are chapters written by women that didn't make the final cut, so to speak.

Jesus chose men as His disciples/apostles. He did however have many men and women followers at that time, and His teachings to be disciples goes to all men and women.
What did Paul have to say about women? I'm just wondering 'if' there were books written by women that could be put in the Bible if it would be too contradictory to Paul's teachings. Were women allowed, or taught, how to write back then? I was understanding that only men were taught how to read and write, (well, some) and like Peter, I don't think he knew how to read or write but had Mark do that for him?
So if that's the case, that women weren't allowed to read or write, then those writings by women were possibly written much much later taking away from the firsthand accounts or accounts written with the firsthander's actual experiences taken.
That would be something worth researching. I think roles of men and women were clearly drawn and accepted back then and perhaps the education of writing and reading were for men and childrearing were for women? Hmm, now my head itches

[petiepanzer]

This rumor has been around long before the Da Vinci code. In fact, the mormons started it and teach this as truth. They teach that Jesus was married to Mary, Mary Magdalene, and Martha as plural wives and that they had many children together. That is one of the reasons they are so into genealogy, the other being that they can charge people money on earth to save the souls of their dead relatives, thereby guaranteeing their passage into heaven and into the mormon religion.

I'm sorry, but I just have a tough time believing anything that comes from that religion. After all, it was founded by Joseph Smith, a habitual liar, sexual pederast, and horse thief that died in a jail cell. Among their other crazy teachings:

God's real name is Elohim. He was once a man on another planet, but through devoted service to mormonism, he was able to become a god of this planet. He has set the example that anyone can become a god of their own planet if they are faithful to the religion.

Through sex with his hundreds of celestial wives, god has created all of the people on earth.

In the beginning, god was sitting around with his sons and was trying to determine the plan that should be used here on earth. One of his sons, Satan, came up with one plan for the world, while his other son, Jesus, came up with another. God decided to go with Jesus's plan and this made Satan very angry. He decided to lead a revolt and convinced 1/3 of the angels to side with him. These became demons and were never to possess a physical body. The people that stayed neutral were cursed with black skin, while those who sided with Jesus and God remained "righteous and fair."

Jesus later came to the Americas with a tribe of ancient Israelites, who were the ancestors to the Native Americans. After Jesus left, one band of Israelites, the Lamanites, attacked the other band of Israelites, called the Nephites. They pretty much wiped all of them out around 400 A.D., except for one named Moroni. He took some ancient tablets made of gold and buried them in upstate New York. As punishment for killing the Nephites, god made the Indians red skinned and black haired.

Later, this angel Moroni came to Joseph Smith and told him where to find these ancient golden tablets. Of course, nobody else could see them, except for Joseph Smith. He was allowed to copy from behind a partition these ancient texts, and then translated them by placing his face into a hat with an ancients seer stone. This gave him the ability to see the hieroglyphics in english and dictate them to another man.

Now, despite common sense and DNA tests that show no genetic relation between native Americans and the Israelites, some people still believe in this religion. It is absolute bull, and people should realize just what kind of a mind control cult it really is.

[gitpikker58]

Wow, that's more about Mormonism than I'd ever really wanted to know. Just goes to show it's good to know your friends but good to know your enemies better, or is that keep your friend close and your enemies in the closet, or something like better a friend than an enema?
Oh well, yeah, it just goes to show what influence one person can have and how it grows exponentially.

[mopnglo]

As far as women not being allowed to write, I don't think that has any bearing on the situation.

The first 5 chapters of the bible were written by Moses and took over 1000 years to complete. In the beginning his stories were carried over orally, in stories, songs, etc. The earliest form of writing was hieroglyphics (sp?) According to the bible, Moses knew the way's of the Egyptians, so I'm assuming his first writings were in hieroglyphics.

Then of course there is the book of Ruth. So I'm not saying that women were not disciples or even that they were alienated from the bible. Going back to the original topic, "could Jesus and Mary have children" According to the bible, some might not think it possible. But take the bible as a whole. The first some odd chapters happened way before Moses was even born, the tellings were oral and passed down through generations and recounted by man (and man is fallible). It has been proven that there were other scrolls, written during biblical time, I believe they are now called agnostic scrolls? Take all of this in consideration, isn't it possible that what is contained within the bible, had bearing on what was allowed/disallowed at the time? And the parts that would go against the whole scheme of things was neglected to be included?

Okay, I'm probably being clear as mud, so I'll give a little background as to what I believe. I do believe there is one God, and Jesus was his son. As far as the bible goes. I believe it is a recount of the experience of the disciples, but ultimately written by man. It has been proven time again that man is a fallible being, not to mention Genesis happened way before Moses was even born and his telling of it was passed through generations orally, this in itself is way open for error. Also the bible, for the most part is written in parables, open for interpretation, each interpretation meaning something differently for the reader. Then you take in to consideration the "times", what where the laws of the land, what would be disruptive to the governing bodies, etc. I think there are several things that were not included in the bible, so yes I think it's possible that Jesus and Mary had children. I also think it wise to look outside the bible for answers, as I don't think it possible it contains all of the answers.

[peacefulwarrior]

Hi mopnglo,
;)Just for clarity sake it's not the agnostic scrolls, but the gnostic scrolls. There is a big difference because the A in greek means not or no and gnostic means knowledge or to know. Agnosticism and gnosticism are the opposites of each other.

:)Check it out by google.

;DI appreciate your sharing your background and ideas. Thanks. You would enjoy looking into the gnostic gospels. I found them very interesting.

:)Do you think it was a virgin birth???

Peace

[gitpikker58]

In today's terms a virgin birth would have to happen to an ugly third grader (bad joke)
The Bible was inspired by the Holy Spirit through men (and some women). The New Testament was written by men, and I'm sure the Holy Spirit inspired the words for those too, and when translated to English and other languages I believe those translations are inspired by the Holy Spirit.
One thing we MUST remember is that WE interpret whatever is written in the Bible THROUGH the Holy Spirit too. Without that interpretation of the Holy Spirit the Bible is too strange for common man to understand. satan confuses the unsaved, and tries to confuse the saved, so that doesn't help, but only through the Holy Spirit can we understand anything in the Bible. So for all purposes the only word in the Bible could be 'oooohhhmmmm', and through the interpretation of the Holy Spirit we would know exactly what it means, without that interpretation it just looks like a meditative word.

[bullgodd]

Wow, petiepanzer you get into this Mormon stuff, tell us some of the crazy things the Baptist believe in, will ya?

I've heard about Jesus & Mary hookin up, & who some of their offspring were. Anybody want to take a shot at it?